Number 7

[Wyrdsister]

We are up to 7 road deaths already this year http://www.theroyalgazette.com/siftology.royalgazette/Article/article.jsp?articleId=7d75fb330030008&sectionId=60  and it is only May!  I didn't even realise that we had had 6!

[loki]

We are up to 7 road deaths already this year http://www.theroyalgazette.com/siftology.royalgazette/Article/article.jsp?articleId=7d75fb330030008&sectionId=60  and it is only May!  I didn't even realise that we had had 6!

Yep, and they were all wonderful young'uns who loved their moms, helped old ladies to cross the street, and butter wouldn't melt in their mouths.

[Casual Observer]

Little need for the sarcasm my friend. Regardless of anything on a personal level the fact is that families have been left behind to pick up the pieces and that is tragic. Everybody is painted a saint upon their deathbeds and I'm not sure what the point in your sarcasm is. As the family member of a road traffic victim (my uncle was left for dead on the side of the road after being plowed over by a drunk driver who was never charged with the offense as he had fled from the scene) I think that your comments smack of insensitivity and think that you might be a little less sarcastic were the situation a little close to home. I pray though that you never have to experience such a tragedy.

[loki]

Little need for the sarcasm my friend. Regardless of anything on a personal level the fact is that families have been left behind to pick up the pieces and that is tragic. Everybody is painted a saint upon their deathbeds and I'm not sure what the point in your sarcasm is. As the family member of a road traffic victim (my uncle was left for dead on the side of the road after being plowed over by a drunk driver who was never charged with the offense as he had fled from the scene) I think that your comments smack of insensitivity and think that you might be a little less sarcastic were the situation a little close to home. I pray though that you never have to experience such a tragedy.

Your own personal situation aside, for which you have my sympathies, and as much sympathy as I may have with the families, I do not need a lesson in sensitivity from you, I assure you. The fact remains that the vast majority of the road 'victims' in Bermuda die because they are behaving like insensitive assholes who didn't give a shit about me, you or anybody else using the road. Why are the vast majority of these 'victims' any different from the scumbag that killed your uncle? I daresay that, if the drunk driver who killed your uncle had also managed to kill himself in the process, you wouldn't think more highly of him because he happened to die. I can have sympathy with the families, but not for the 'victims', who often achieve nothing more than thankfully killing themselves before they kill innocent road users.

[SmokingGun]

Yo Lokes - someone cut you off on the way to work this morning?

As much as we have a problem with morons on the road who are often too high to give a rats arse about anyone else we also happen to have conditions that are making things more likely than ever to get into trouble. The more cars and trucks the more likely we'll have accidents. The bigger they are the more likley we'll have accidents. The more rubber that meets the road and the more grease that builds up the more likely we'll have accidents. The less care we take in keeping the roads safe, the less parental control or police patrol, the more booze we pour without taking responsibilty for our customer's safety the more accidents we'll have.

And in some of those cases, yes we'll lose some wonderful young'uns who loved their moms, helped old ladies to cross the street, and butter wouldn't melt in their mouths.

[Casual Observer]

Little need for the sarcasm my friend. Regardless of anything on a personal level the fact is that families have been left behind to pick up the pieces and that is tragic. Everybody is painted a saint upon their deathbeds and I'm not sure what the point in your sarcasm is. As the family member of a road traffic victim (my uncle was left for dead on the side of the road after being plowed over by a drunk driver who was never charged with the offense as he had fled from the scene) I think that your comments smack of insensitivity and think that you might be a little less sarcastic were the situation a little close to home. I pray though that you never have to experience such a tragedy.

The fact remains that the vast majority of the road 'victims' in Bermuda die because they are behaving like insensitive assholes who didn't give a **** about me, you or anybody else using the road.

loki - what evidence are you using to qualify this statement!? Some of these victims are just that... VICTIMS! We cannot quantify the number of fatalities that are attributable to 'assholism' and you seem to be painting all with the same broad brush. I seem to recall a similar statement on LIB sometime in a previous life (actually, it  may even have been on this site) where the poster claimed that all road traffic fatalities were little more than young, stupid black men on bikes who went jammin down the road and slammed up into a wall. When the names, ages, races of the victims from the previous years fatalities were broken down this proved NOT to be the case. Moreoften than not, it's not the idiots who wind up needing to be scraped up off the floor (if this was the case there'd be a lot less of them,right?) Many of them are regular people who had ACCIDENTS which can not necessarily be put down to insensitive, reckless behaviour. Statistics released this week stated that alcohol was a factor in half of the fatalities last year... That does not necessarily mean the VICTIMS were drunk... just that alcohol was a factor. The dickhead who plowed them over might have been drunk.  Your comments above seem to throw the baby out with the bath water. There are fatalities and then there are victims. However, the real victims are the families that are left behind.

[loki]

Little need for the sarcasm my friend. Regardless of anything on a personal level the fact is that families have been left behind to pick up the pieces and that is tragic. Everybody is painted a saint upon their deathbeds and I'm not sure what the point in your sarcasm is. As the family member of a road traffic victim (my uncle was left for dead on the side of the road after being plowed over by a drunk driver who was never charged with the offense as he had fled from the scene) I think that your comments smack of insensitivity and think that you might be a little less sarcastic were the situation a little close to home. I pray though that you never have to experience such a tragedy.

The fact remains that the vast majority of the road 'victims' in Bermuda die because they are behaving like insensitive assholes who didn't give a **** about me, you or anybody else using the road.

loki - what evidence are you using to qualify this statement!? Some of these victims are just that... VICTIMS! We cannot quantify the number of fatalities that are attributable to 'assholism' and you seem to be painting all with the same broad brush. I seem to recall a similar statement on LIB sometime in a previous life (actually, it  may even have been on this site) where the poster claimed that all road traffic fatalities were little more than young, stupid black men on bikes who went jammin down the road and slammed up into a wall. When the names, ages, races of the victims from the previous years fatalities were broken down this proved NOT to be the case. Moreoften than not, it's not the idiots who wind up needing to be scraped up off the floor (if this was the case there'd be a lot less of them,right?) Many of them are regular people who had ACCIDENTS which can not necessarily be put down to insensitive, reckless behaviour. Statistics released this week stated that alcohol was a factor in half of the fatalities last year... That does not necessarily mean the VICTIMS were drunk... just that alcohol was a factor. The dickhead who plowed them over might have been drunk.  Your comments above seem to throw the baby out with the bath water. There are fatalities and then there are victims. However, the real victims are the families that are left behind.

I'm afraid that I have nothing more to base my view on than anecdotal evidence gleaned from my time in the police force, in which I frequently assisted with inquests and the like, as well as normal police work, and my later experience as an attorney. In my experience, the vast majority of road deaths involving single vehicle accidents involve motorcyclists traveling at excessive speed (more often than not, SERIOUSLY excessive speed) and losing control of their vehicles as a consequence. The typical scenario involved in deaths arising from multi-vehicle accidents, is one, again, of excessive speed and reckless driving (generally, though not exclusively, such accidents involve either overtaking when unable to see oncoming traffic [blind corners, crests of hills, etc] or overtaking when oncoming traffic is clearly visible, but attempting to squeeze between lines of traffic or 'beat' the oncoming traffic. Thankfully, in the case of fatal multi-vehicle accidents, the reckless party usually manages to avoid causing serious injury or death to others.

[blackrum]

To some degree, I agree with you Loki. Over many years I observed youngsters and others of the middle age bracket doing excessive speeds whilst the roads were void of traffic at particular times. The old adage of venting and if I get a ticket, big deal.

Having someone come through my winshield in l968 and watching him die in front of me will never leave me. Their choice of driving drunk. I know they rest in peace but the memory still haunts me everytime I read about these incidents.

Everyone, ...slow down..tomorrow never comes because it becomes today.

Rummy.

Ps. Through bad judgement other situations may occur which may not harm you but can change the lives for better or worse of others.

One Love.

[Captain Canuck]

First and foremost, my condolences to the family and friends.  The pain they have to go through is tough and their's to deal with in their own ways.

Loki, although you're frustration at the way a seemingly large percentage of bike riders treat the roads is warranted, this is not the thread for that.  I didn't know the other 6 individuals that died, but i did know one, and i can ASSURE you he was the best there is and you'd be hard pressed to match his character (as i don't know you i'll leave that up to you to decide).  To make a generalization in the context that it was in is displaying a lack of tact on your part.  I'm not disagreeing with you, just saying that in light of the sensitivity of people's loss, save the frustration for a better area.

CC

[Reality]

I took a road trip with Mike this week. As I drove (with Mike dozing next to me) I pondered the potential for disaster. No matter that I drive with care and sobriety, I feel very much aware of the fact that not every driver on the road affords me the same courtesy.

Even with my level of care, I can't say I have never made a mistake on the road - I was fortunate not to pay the cost.

Part of the problem in Bermuda I think is that speeding and drink driving are so broadly accepted. To some extent, everyone who accepts those behaviours is contributing to road problems.

All that aside, no matter the cause of the accidents, it is always a tragic loss to a family somewhere. I feel both for the families and also for the police and medical staff involved in having to try to pick up the pieces.

[BlueEyedDevil]

Bermuda is a hazardous driving environment. Narrow, twisting roads with rock walls on either side are dangerous. On the other hand at low speeds any accident that does occur should not be too serious.

I have to go with Loki. Most of the problem is speeding and aggressive driving. I have never been to Cairo or Rome but I have never seen worse driving anywhere else. The rudeness and aggressiveness bothers me more than anything. I see things everyday that would get you shot in LA.

I think Bermudians are such terrible drivers because at the low speeds you can drive badly and nothing happens. People who drive on freeways learn to carefully control their vehicle and drive closely to other vehicles at high speed without getting into another driver's space. Unfortunately when you pick up the speed you need to pick up the attention and skill level and Bermudians who speed die pretty regularly.

Ideally you would see police officers on traffic duty stopping and ticketing speeders and careless and aggressive passers. But in Bermuda enforcing the law is considered cruel and unusual so that will never happen. Sobriety checkpoints would discourage drunk driving without requiring much police manpower, but that will never happen either.

David Burch is a man with strong opinions, strongly stated, and to read of him saying he's "helpless" is surprising to me. Let me do my David Burch impression on the subject-

"You idiots! Slow down! This is a very small island, you aren't going to get there any faster! Show some basic courtesy and wait your turn. If you're going to pass, wait til the opposite lane is clear and pass well clear. Keep both your feet on the damn scooter, it is necessary for balance and control. And if you care about nothing else, if you don't care if you live or die, remember your family does not want to attend your funeral."

[bean counter]

just to bring this thread back to ding bats w/ no brake lights -

I like a little distance between me and the car/bike/bus I'm following.  I ride a bike that has plenty of power, and worse case scenario, I only have to go about 10 miles max if I want to hit the end of the country from my house.  Apparently adequate following distance is a major problem and a heinous cause of congestion for the people behind me.

This morning around 820 or so a very rude dude in a light blue hyundai excel (mid 90s, I'd guess), Tag number 22730 if I remember correctly, flew up my bottom and passed me on Harrington Sound Road right around the school.  He then needed to slam his brakes in order to not devour the bumper the car I had been previously following.  Surprise Surprise, no brake lights.

Thanks for the adreneline rush!

Fix your *#&^#*^&%# brake lights, DING BAT!

TTFN