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January 09, 2009, 07:22:22 AM

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76371 Posts in 4155 Topics by 860 Members Latest Member: - Rockys Most online today: 16 - most online ever: 66 (June 14, 2007, 11:37:46 AM)

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Author Topic: False economy  (Read 407 times)
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jthomps15
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« on: July 05, 2008, 06:23:24 PM »

So, I'm reading with great interest...
as potential Bermuda expats (can you be that?), have some questions.

If I'm going to pack most of my worldly possessions into a box and move as far around the world as we possibly can (in Australia now), we want to know that after 3 years (or 6 years?) we come back to Australia with some cash in back pocket.

Every post talks about expensive living.  Granted, the rents are high, but I'm really starting to wonder if Australia shouldn't be on that 'expensive place to live' list as well - as an example -

I am a teacher, gross about $60,000 AU$.  (Add about 5% exchange rate to US$, if my maths is right, and taking into consideration Bermuda tax, that's about $60,000 in Bermuda money).  Aust govt takes 33% off the top - I take home about $40,000 net of that.

Comparing costs as per Jimmy's post - last month we paid rent $1100, phone and internet $300, electricity $130.  Grocery-wise - milk costs about $3.50 for 2l (about that half gallon, I think?), bread ranges from $2 for nasty cardboard white sliced to $5 for something interesting from the bakery;  eggs = $3 per dozen;  one-meal size bag of mixed salad = $4; strawberries $4 for about a dozen (I don't know how many strawberries are in a pint!!)  meat - mince = $11/kg, grilling steak = dodgy stuff for $13/kg [$26 per lb?] or really good stuff $20-30/kg;  liquor - 750ml rum = $35;  etc etc.  A rum and coke at the local pub costs $5, and my daughter parties on $10 cocktails (so she tells me).

I see that groceries are more expensive - but they're not double, or more, going by the lists people have kindly gathered and posted.

So here's the thing - if I am keeping pretty much all of that $60,000, I am still better off by $20,000 on those figures.  If the recruitment agencies are to be believed (and I say that tongue in cheek, given some posts I've read!) teaching salary is $70-80,000.  If my partner is working as a refrigeration mechanic, SURELY we should be able to stash away some useful funds by the end of the time..... or what am I missing?  We are one of those 'smug-married' couples mentioned in an earlier post, who won't be looking for nightclubs as primary source of entertainment.... 

Dose of reality required, please?  [with apologies in advance for the maths content - I know it's Saturday night there!]

Jillian (and Peter)
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jthomps15
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« Reply #1 on: July 05, 2008, 06:28:12 PM »

I'd try for BD$120,000 pa.... maybe settle for $100,000.  Shocked Cool

What occupations is that relevant for?  How about fridge mechanic?  teacher? PA?  Good fridgie can get $120,000 in the mines in Australia;  experienced senior teachers get about $90,000.....
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Mike
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« Reply #2 on: July 08, 2008, 03:39:42 AM »

If I'm going to pack most of my worldly possessions into a box and move as far around the world as we possibly can (in Australia now), we want to know that after 3 years (or 6 years?) we come back to Australia with some cash in back pocket.

No wonder nobody replied to you post...

 Grin

How funny is that?  Reality and I quit Bermuda to move to Brisbane!

I'll have to recover from my laughing fit after reading your post, but for now I'll just say you'd have to have 'roos lose in the top paddock to move the other direction.
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jthomps15
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« Reply #3 on: July 08, 2008, 08:36:08 AM »

So glad I could be of entertainment value.....

However, maybe you would explain, all the same?

Jillian

(PS - no more roos where we are - hour and a bit from Brisvegas - than in the Queen Street mall.... )
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Wassup
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« Reply #4 on: July 08, 2008, 06:03:01 PM »

Jillian, your agency is quoting you an accurate figure, I believe.  I worked at the Ministry of Education as a summer student some years back and that number sounds about right for teachers salaries (in the public system anyway).  It's all done on scales and back then entry level salaries for teachers was around 50-60k (this was around 10 years ago). 

Just note that most of the teaching positions on the island which are available to expats are for middle school level and up as, apparently, there are enough Bermudians available to teach at the pre-school and primary level.  Special education is in high demand.  Also, if you're able to teach more than one subject (e.g. history and PE, maths and science, etc.) that puts you ahead of the game as well.

Your other half should make good money in his trade so you both should do well.  My friend's husband worked for Bda Air Conditioning for a few months (went home because he missed his now wife).  He did say that the 'helpers' tended to leave something to be desired but that, overall, it wasn't a bad job.

Cost of living in Bermuda is expensive but if you manage to find a reasonable place to live, don't party or travel too too much and get around with a moped, you should be able to stash away a little something, I think.

Also, I wouldn't recommend packing and bringing your worldly possessions, it's best to bring the bare minimum with you.  The Customs officers love to burn you with duty and if you don't have receipts, they get to assign what they think is a reasonable price and tax you on it.  There are always house sales where you can pick up great electronics and furniture at a decent price because of people selling their things when they leave the island.  I'm sure you've heard of e-moo as well - lots of good deals on there too.

I hope this helped answer some of your questions.  Feel free to ask if you need more info; this board is a wealth of information, as others have mentioned before.  Smiley
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« Reply #5 on: July 08, 2008, 07:08:50 PM »

Thanks Wassup you got me off the  hook, I had promised a reply to Jillian at the weekend, and have been busy with work and guests and have been unable to devote the required time formulate any type of reply.

I would add that if you own a house to consider renting it whilst you are away. I thought I would only get two years when I came out, now 10 years later.... I still have my house, and although it needs a significant amount of work, I know that I have something permanent to go "home" to.
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Mike
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« Reply #6 on: July 09, 2008, 06:42:00 AM »

So glad I could be of entertainment value.....

However, maybe you would explain, all the same?

How about the likely scenario that you quit after three months when you discover just how badly screwed up the system is?  Your fixed costs of moving will have been sunk and you won't get another work permit in another sector.  Your husband will still be waiting for permission to seek employment, or for a 'fast-track' permit, so there won't be anything on the income side of his equation to help out.

I've personally worked in the schools (as an IT consultant), and we have a close friend who was an expat teacher there (including the "special needs" as Wassup mentioned), and you really wouldn't belive the stories of abuse I could recount.  (OK just one; our friend was disciplined after she spoke up about another teacher hitting a student - the expat must have been the liar in spite of the evidence, right?)

Perhaps you'll be one of those to turn a blind eye and stay, telling yourself you can endure it for the money and hoping you can make a difference.  Either way, good luck and enjoy comparing how much you've saved with your smug-married friends.
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jthomps15
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« Reply #7 on: July 09, 2008, 09:21:51 AM »

Gee, thanks, Wassup and Jimmy Jones - a little bit of balance!

If we come to Bermuda, we will both come with jobs.  The info you have given is helpful, and you can probably expect some more questions over the next while - it's just that it's almost midnight here and my brain is frozen....

Mike hasn't been in Australia very long yet.  He is about to find out that the problems in education aren't restricted to Bermuda!  I can share some horror stories of my own about what happens.  It seems to depend very much on the school, and who's running it;  but there is plenty of scope for things to go wrong - starting with what happens at home!  I hope for his sake that Australia lives up to expectations, so that he doesn't have to work out less than flattering remarks about Aus when he packs up and moves to the next place.

just a note, I am a secondary teacher, trained in english and history, but with experience in home economics, hospitality, mathematics and remedial classes (maths, english, lifeskills).   Peter has 28 years experience in refrigeration. 

Thanks again - I will be back with more questions when I've had some sleep!!!!

Jillian   (guarding her jugular, just in case....)

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Mike
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« Reply #8 on: July 10, 2008, 02:37:14 AM »

Gee, thanks, Wassup and Jimmy Jones - a little bit of balance!

You will hear what you want to hear. 

Quote
Mike hasn't been in Australia very long yet.  He is about to find out that the problems in education aren't restricted to Bermuda! 

You have no idea.  But thank you for your condescension for my efforts to give you some perspective before you commit to a huge life change.


[editor's note: fix that darn quote box.]
« Last Edit: July 11, 2008, 12:27:57 AM by Mike » Logged

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jthomps15
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« Reply #9 on: July 10, 2008, 06:42:12 AM »


You have no idea.  But thank you for your condescension for my efforts to give you some perspective before you commit to a huge life change.
[/quote]

Gee, I had no idea that gathering information was going to be so controversial, or that I could inadvertently step on such tender toes!!!

46 years in Australia has given me some insights into my own country, and I guess I'm as free to express them as anyone else.  At the moment, I am hearing everything that's being said, and we will weigh that information up with other information from other sources, and we will make our decision based on our own perceptions and values - just like everyone else does when they commit to a major change.  If I only wanted to hear good things I'd stick with talking to the recruitment people!!

There was no condescension intended in my last post   blink- but it seems to me from some of the other messages I have received that there is a range of opinion out there about whether Bermuda was a positive or not positive experience;  that the idea of spending time on Bermuda is not simply a laughable and ridiculous option;  and most of all, that this forum was one where people were encouraged to share their questions and opinions in a non-judgemental atmosphere. 

One thing intriuges me a little - most of the forum members I have had discussions with have actually left Bermuda, but still remain active in discussions about it, and what is happening there.  I get the feeling that something about the place, or the people, stays with you even after you have moved on....  I have lived in places where I've had bad experiences, and you couldn't pay me to stay in contact with the area, or anyone with connections with it!  So what has Bermuda done to you people, to stay in your blood like this?

J


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