Bermuda Rocks
close
Welcome Guest.






Lost Password?
No account yet? Register
Top Panel
Login / Profile
Top Panel

The Royal Gazette's

The Royal Gazette's A Right to Know - Giving People Power campaign

A Right to Know - Giving People Power campaign 

Swag Shop

Bermuda Rocks 

from CafePress

Only $19.99 + S/H

 

BWS Webcam

Webcam

Looking North toward
St. George's

Rant Room - Bermuda's #1 Forum

*
*
Home
Help
Search
Calendar
Login
Register
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
November 20, 2008, 09:22:39 PM

Login with username, password and session length
Search:     Advanced search
73390 Posts in 3966 Topics by 834 Members Latest Member: - spaman Most online today: 38 - most online ever: 66 (June 14, 2007, 11:37:46 AM)

Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 ... 21   Go Down
Print
Author Topic: Institutional Racism  (Read 6182 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Rummy
Shark Bait
Sucker Star Member
*

Karma: 237
Offline Offline

Posts: 5192



View Profile Awards

Ignore
« Reply #15 on: August 20, 2008, 08:09:55 PM »

I did't accuse him of running away. He called me a "racist". Get the chip of your shoulder deary. Insult? My ass, think about what he wrote on his site then get back when you figure it out.

Then again, your nut ann onion are you. Insult my ass. Huh
Logged

Two Ships pasing in the night.
alsys
Hero Member
*****

Karma: 179
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 793



View Profile Awards

Ignore
« Reply #16 on: August 20, 2008, 08:16:56 PM »

alsys - when someone turns up the volume what does one expect? Tigga comes on and purposely tries to be antagonistic.... does he try to have a conversation? Biggie makes, should I say made, his stupid postings and many beat him down but that doesn't register? He didn't keep coming back. Do I think tigga is a racist? No I don't. I think he's a stupid asshole who's dumber than dumb because he doesn't give a crap that his antics are actually very damaging to relationships in Bermuda. Much like his Uncle Ewart I have absolutely no respect for him. Biggie/Sal is the same and I couldn't give a toss for him/her either but at least they don't keep showing up here.

But this is exactly what tigga, and his backers, set out to do. He wanted to create an environment where we come across as being bigots, or Institutionally Racist. In an attempt to discredit the website. Have you not noticed something? How quiet it became around here recently? Might I suggest why or will I be further labeled as Institutionalized?

Sure I'm partly to blame. I entertain the twerp. I push buttons as well. Maybe I should just try to be blank-faced and only converse in a manner that is more adept to not breaking any egg-shells. Maybe we all should. But hey that's not me. I'll tell it to you as I see it and I expect you to do the same in return. Eventually we will both learn something. Doesn't mean we'll change overnight but at least we'll grow from it.

Having a little fun whilst trying to hold a genuine and honest conversation is one thing. Unfortunately people like tigga just don't get it. And sometimes neither does a guy like Rummy. For such a super-sensitive guy he can be the most insensitive person I've come across. But when it comes to race he's no tigga nor a Biggie/Sal.
Logged

It is hard to tell if a man is telling the truth when you know you would lie if you were in his place."   H. L. Mencken
alsys
Hero Member
*****

Karma: 179
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 793



View Profile Awards

Ignore
« Reply #17 on: August 20, 2008, 08:31:50 PM »

I did't accuse him of running away. He called me a "racist". Get the chip of your shoulder deary. Insult? My ass, think about what he wrote on his site then get back when you figure it out.

Then again, your nut ann onion are you. Insult my ass. Huh

Lordy lordy. Read his post. He does not call you a racist on him site nor does he call you one on here. He comments on how reactions to certain posts of yours as compared to others could be construed as racist. HUGE difference. The only thing he actually accuses "you" of is being insulting by your use of dialect - which he also states is more than likely a persona and not you in RL. In fact, he actually says that he can't comment on whether you (RL you) are raxist as he does not know you. Seriously, read a whole post for once before you get upset.

And for the last time, I have no clue who you seem to think I am. But your accusation of being a non-bermudian or an expat is way off. Unless being a 6th generation bermudian makes me an immigrant    wacko I was born in Bermuda. Lived my whole life here. How about you?

Like seriously, this is like the third time you've accused me of things I did not do/or am not. Next?  Yawn
Logged

It is hard to tell if a man is telling the truth when you know you would lie if you were in his place."   H. L. Mencken
alsys
Hero Member
*****

Karma: 179
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 793



View Profile Awards

Ignore
« Reply #18 on: August 20, 2008, 08:38:12 PM »

alsys - when someone turns up the volume what does one expect? Tigga comes on and purposely tries to be antagonistic.... does he try to have a conversation? Biggie makes, should I say made, his stupid postings and many beat him down but that doesn't register? He didn't keep coming back. Do I think tigga is a racist? No I don't. I think he's a stupid asshole who's dumber than dumb because he doesn't give a crap that his antics are actually very damaging to relationships in Bermuda. Much like his Uncle Ewart I have absolutely no respect for him. Biggie/Sal is the same and I couldn't give a toss for him/her either but at least they don't keep showing up here.

But this is exactly what tigga, and his backers, set out to do. He wanted to create an environment where we come across as being bigots, or Institutionally Racist. In an attempt to discredit the website. Have you not noticed something? How quiet it became around here recently? Might I suggest why or will I be further labeled as Institutionalized?

Sure I'm partly to blame. I entertain the twerp. I push buttons as well. Maybe I should just try to be blank-faced and only converse in a manner that is more adept to not breaking any egg-shells. Maybe we all should. But hey that's not me. I'll tell it to you as I see it and I expect you to do the same in return. Eventually we will both learn something. Doesn't mean we'll change overnight but at least we'll grow from it.

Having a little fun whilst trying to hold a genuine and honest conversation is one thing. Unfortunately people like tigga just don't get it. And sometimes neither does a guy like Rummy. For such a super-sensitive guy he can be the most insensitive person I've come across. But when it comes to race he's no tigga nor a Biggie/Sal.

Man I am pissed. I lost that whole post to you SG. So cliff notes:

1. I agree that tigga is worse. Especially as he makes me feel horrible because just when I think we are communicatin he has a habit of nnoying y'all. So doesn't help.

2. Rummy imo isn't racist. He offends me but that's a personal thing.

More tomorrow...  Wink
Logged

It is hard to tell if a man is telling the truth when you know you would lie if you were in his place."   H. L. Mencken
SmokingGun
Sucker Star Member
*******

Karma: 657
Offline Offline

Posts: 6047


View Profile Awards

Ignore
« Reply #19 on: August 20, 2008, 08:47:03 PM »

Dang - hate when that happens. Looking forward to tomorrow. Have a good night. Smiley
Logged
Urchin
Full Member
***

Karma: 48
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 151


Playing with fire


View Profile Awards

Ignore
« Reply #20 on: August 20, 2008, 09:30:09 PM »

Just wanted to say that I will respond fully once I have more time.  Moving house and island and selling ones accumulated life possessions is taking much more of my free time than I had thought.  D'oh.

@Crimson Dynamo - I'll look forward to hearing your thoughts on the various points you have brought up sometime down the road  In the meantime, godspeed on your journey, both physical and intellectual.

From my perspective, arriving a little late to the scene, it's hard to tell what came first, the attacks from other posters, or Tigga's posturing posts. Tigga actually does (sometimes) make apparently sincere and thought-provoking contributions. But even then it's just a matter of time before the whole thread descends into ranting and semantics from both 'sides'.

If you are right, and Tigga's posturings are some sort of misguided but essentially altruistic tactic to get others to see their own behaviour in a different light all I can say is that it doesn't appear to be working, and unless Tigga is slow on the uptake (which I don't for one moment think he is), he'll change his tactics.

If on the other hand his motives are less altruistic, as some posters have hinted, nuff said.
Logged

Lately it occurs to me what a long strange trip it's been . . .
Darkside
Moderator
Superhero Member
*****

Karma: 203
Offline Offline

Posts: 1439


Dark Lord


View Profile Awards
« Reply #21 on: August 20, 2008, 09:44:40 PM »

Personally all I want is for discourse to occur sans the name-calling, trolling and baiting ... all well-reasoned points of view should be considered valid ... however some of them may not be viable.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2008, 09:50:39 PM by Darkside » Logged

“There are no facts, only interpretations.” - Friedrich Nietzsche
“Freedom is what you do with what's been done to you.” - Jean-Paul Sartre
Uncle Elvis
Legendary Member
******

Karma: 298
Offline Offline

Posts: 2891


Peace be with you.


View Profile WWW Awards

Ignore
« Reply #22 on: August 20, 2008, 10:50:45 PM »

Personally all I want is for discourse to occur sans the name-calling, trolling and baiting ... all well-reasoned points of view should be considered valid... however some of them may not be viable

Just thought I'd reiterate that.
Logged

"It's not: whether or not you're going to get reamed... It's: Who's going to have the decency to give you a reach-around!"
-Uncle Elvis-

"Happiness DEMANDS giving up all hope of a better past"
-Nelson Mandela-

Oh, and for those who don't know, my name is Mike Hind.
LostinFlatts
Jr. Member
**

Karma: 16
Offline Offline

Posts: 66


View Profile Awards

Ignore
« Reply #23 on: August 21, 2008, 06:42:15 AM »

Sorry, only just read this. Now I don't want to get into the Rummy argument, or discuss the virtues of communism, or even talk about racism.

Johnny - if you think Vanz is on here 'holding up a mirror' you're either misinformed, blinded or just plain crazy. The only person I'd put in the same league as him in terms of intent is Biggie/Sal, who I haven't seen on here for ages after he was rightly shunned by the regulars.

What Vanz does is very different, and I could care less about his use of language.
He spreads lies/misinformation - see the recent example of the letter to editor debacle, which he of course escalated to Mr. Burt over at the official PLP website which now features an entry on the blog. Which of course doesn't give Bill Zuill or anyone a right to respond, I mean why would they?

He consistently and deliberately derails topics - Countless examples of this, posters will be discussing something innocuous, and along comes Vanz to start stirring sh*t up with talk of racism out of left field. Cue Elvis calling him out, Rummy calling him names and others giving up on the topic.

He poses questions in a serious manner, but he doesn't give two sh*ts about answers - this is my personal pet peeve. He'll ask something, I'll answer and follow with a question, and he will simply ignore it. You can ask him the most direct question on Earth, Vanz how do you take your coffee and his response will be along the lines of 'You crackers don't know about tea. Tea is something my people have known about for years. Go watch some New Zealand show.'

He is, by definition, a troll - That should be banned until he can contribute something positive.

He is also a false beacon of hope - A whole load of posters on here desperately want to reach out to understand the PLP and their supporters, and he occasionally baits us in with a reasoned argument, but then abandons it when push comes to shove. He is a tease, and he seems to just love it.

Anyway, it just frustrates me that the blogosphere/this site has great potential to gather some momentum and get all walks of Bermuda life involved, but he and the reaction he causes will continue to prevent that happening. I step down off of my soap box.
Logged
Rummy
Shark Bait
Sucker Star Member
*

Karma: 237
Offline Offline

Posts: 5192



View Profile Awards

Ignore
« Reply #24 on: August 21, 2008, 07:11:55 AM »

Alsys, my sincerest appoligies. I have/had you confused with another poster.

I was going to write this long post but decieded it would not be needed. What I read on Mr. Starlings site in my opinion was that he did call or catorgories me with those traits or possession of a racist attitude. I still do.

He brought it up and I have every right to dispell anything related. Yes I can be a pain in the ass, thats my job. It only reinforces my beliefs and concern that there are thousands of relly pissed off people in Bermuda. Times are hard everywhere and emotions rise and fall but Bermuda is in a unique situation and that being small and you don't really have to go out of your way or far to communicate positively if you really want. The "you" includes all residents.

Since obtaining my Masters in Zoooligy (big zoo) I have gained much from observation. My Phd. fromMIT in Socioligy leaves me wonder more and anticipating less.

Gotta run............who let the dogs out.......hoot hoot...... Smiley
Logged

Two Ships pasing in the night.
Martin
Hero Member
*****

Karma: 64
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 676



View Profile Awards

Ignore
« Reply #25 on: August 21, 2008, 07:37:20 AM »

One of things that hits you in BDA very squarely in the face, is the extent to which and, more importantly - the ease with which - the terms racist and racism are used.

Having worked in 3 countries and visited 47 over the years, I have NEVER witnessed anything like it. I accept it is difficult to determine much of a local environment just on a visit/vacation, but generally speaking you can pick up the vibes.

Whether it is a product of the island's history, or a product of it's size, or an over used defence mechanism I don't know, but I do wish people would stop and think before using the term(s). We seem to have reached the stage in society generally, as well as on this blog from time to time, where if you don't like something - it must be racist. I mean, it just couldn't possibly be anything else - could it?

The ability to have a meaningful convo or simply to set out views which differ from others is lost, often because one spends half one's efforts picking words with care - just in case there is a subtle innuendo one has missed and someone might be offended if it isn't corrected. The ability to be critical - whether negative or positive - is lost...because someone might be offended.

I also think it masks the real opportunity to debate the issue in so far as it affects BDA.

Just my opinion.
Logged

Never pick a fight with an ugly person, they've got nothing to lose.

Robin Williams
Casual Observer
Legendary Member
******

Karma: 466
Offline Offline

Posts: 2084



View Profile Awards




Ignore

« Reply #26 on: August 21, 2008, 07:50:30 AM »

Ummm... okay. I'm gonna go out on a limb here... well. Not really.

This isn't the first time that the tigga/biggie thing has been mentioned. And I'm not quite sure that it can be so easily discounted. The reality is that biggie/sal WAS a regular poster on this site and in spite of numerous offensive and racist posts, little was said about his behaviour by the regular posters. In fact, his karma count was up there before I took it upon myself to smite him hourly following a particularly offensive and personal post.

I've been a member on here for... I dunno... and I was shocked and appalled that biggie was allowed to get away with some of the crap he posted and regularly found myself to be the lone voice in the wilderness crying foul over his posts, oftentimes with little or no support from the regular posters who simply passed him off as a nutjob. When i have the time to find the threads, I will post them.

So I too question how tigga, as offensive as some may find him has managed to rack up negative gazillion karma points and biggie would barely get a slap on the wrist.

Odd.
Logged

"My role in society, or any artist's or poet's role, is to try and express what we all feel. Not to tell people how to feel. Not as a preacher, not as a leader, but as a reflection of us all.”

John Lennon
Rummy
Shark Bait
Sucker Star Member
*

Karma: 237
Offline Offline

Posts: 5192



View Profile Awards

Ignore
« Reply #27 on: August 21, 2008, 08:28:41 AM »

I must admit that I am a bit bewildered myself. After checking the stats, Tigga did post three times as much and they roughly spent the same amount of time 'on-line'.

I did smite Tigga on numerous occassions because of some of his vile and racist comments. I also did the same with Biggie. But I am one member and there are 700 odd here. And be assured that when I needed mine I sure as hell got them.

Anyway.....um gunna mow dee lahawn.......ann dwink sum more coughhy.........

A great day too all. Smiley
Logged

Two Ships pasing in the night.
The D
Sr. Member
****

Karma: 52
Offline Offline

Posts: 364


View Profile Awards

Ignore
« Reply #28 on: August 21, 2008, 09:05:12 AM »

CO,

I have this idea in my head and I’m struggling to put it into words so forgive me if this makes no sense.

I’ve never really gotten into the karma / smite routine on this site, so I can’t say for sure, but could it be that the collective reaction to tigga was because he was lumping together and attacking the posters on this site?  Is it easier to ignore racist / offensive language when it’s directed at someone ‘out there’ then when it’s directed at a group of people that are ‘in here’?   
Logged
Uncle Elvis
Legendary Member
******

Karma: 298
Offline Offline

Posts: 2891


Peace be with you.


View Profile WWW Awards

Ignore
« Reply #29 on: August 21, 2008, 09:09:17 AM »

Sorry, but I have to ask this...

Yes I can be a pain in the ass, thats my job

Your JOB? Who offered you this job? Seriously.
How is what you do here your JOB?


I'm keeping my mouth shut on this whole subject because a) i certainly hope Mr. Starling was generalizing in his comments, as I consider myself the exception to the rule, and b) we all know that if I threw my two cents in, it would turn into a screaming match. It's sad that fear of yet another flame war has pretty much censored me, but there you go.


Logged

"It's not: whether or not you're going to get reamed... It's: Who's going to have the decency to give you a reach-around!"
-Uncle Elvis-

"Happiness DEMANDS giving up all hope of a better past"
-Nelson Mandela-

Oh, and for those who don't know, my name is Mike Hind.
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 ... 21   Go Up
Print
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.7 | SMF © 2006-2008, Simple Machines LLC
Joomla Bridge by JoomlaHacks.com

Oxygen design by Bloc
Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!